Suggestions for Becoming Death's Action Plan

[Quinn]

---Duncan, you made the simple mistake of actually walking up to talk to Quinn. You could have used the tactical radio (which everyone has) or even shouted. I was in the next room. You could have stayed where you were behind the counters, set your rifle on the counters and continued firing. You could have gone back in once the grenade exploded. I don't fault you for leaving the room because of that grenade.

But you disengaged entirely. That is the crux of the problem here. Dirk is correct in that is an Article 99. You disengaged, then didn't get back in line when ordered to do so by your squad leader.

To be honest, me saying that Duncan should be given an Article 15 is a relative slap on the wrist.

---Dirk, will also be given an Article 15 for striking a fellow Marine. But since he is a Sergeant, he cannot be busted below a Sergeant's rank. Pay grade is different.

What an Article 15 does is drop you a few ranks along with your pay grade, along with extra duties not to exceed more than three months. This usually consists of extra guard duty on base.

[Duncan]

Well the main problem there comes from the fact that in general no one was aware of the disconnect on what everyone was seeing until a few days ago. It's not as much a double standard, as much as it is bad timing.

I get that. But when it was presumed that my character did something wrong, several people were falling all over each other to suggest punishment. Dirk's character, similarly, has done something wrong IC. Unless I'm now misreading his post and it turns out he tripped and accidentally spun my character around and punched him, his character should be held to the same standard.

Really though this entire incident spawned from you jumping out of the way from the grenade. A grenade that was specified as being thrown as far away as Honeysett could. Honeysett has been a marine a long time, and would know if something was going to hit us or not. Dirk and Morse have as well, and neither of us moved. We both posted after Honeysett, and those posts also came before you.

You were the only one that decided not to give Honeysett the benefit of the doubt and jumped to the back.- Really this all could have been avoided if you had just not looked at the three of us like we were idiots for standing in place as someone threw a grenade well beyond the blast radius.

- We're not talking about real grenades, we're talking about the same weapon Ripley fired only a few feet away from herself and she was fine.

I again point out that enclosed spaces amplify the effects of explosives. This was a factor in the last mission (the relevant quote is in my post on page 2 of this thread). So, while it wasn't an issue in Aliens, it is taken into account in NIck's campaign. When I wrote my post, I knew Honeysett didn't throw the grenade at our feet, and had we been in an open environment, my character wouldn't have jumped into the next room. Based on our last mission, IC and OOC, I expected characters in the kitchen to be impaired or wounded as a result. I intended my next post to be heading back to the kitchen to give medical aid to the rest of the squad.

Now, Honeysett's grenade exploded and no ill effects came of it. However, in Nick's post, he wrote that shrapnel flew by the marines (the quote for this is also mentioned in the same post as the other). OOC, I took this to mean that Nick was going easy on the squad and giving an implied warning. Before I posted, Farzi fired another grenade. So again, IC and OOC, I considered it prudent to take cover again. Admittedly, in hindsight, I may have been reading too much into the post. However, this wasn't an attempt to second guess other PCs. IC and OOC, I was acting based on recent experience.

Also, technically, it spawned from your character shouting that my character was fleeing. I get you and others misread the post, and your character is kind of a jerk, and that he saw neither the LT's suspicious behavior nor Quinn's order. However, I do find it odd that he was able to notice Duncan, who was behind Morse, leaving the room over the roar and flash of his smartgun, but is either unaware or unconcerned about shrapnel past.

Don't worry about double standards. The only one that's gonna tear up your sheet is you or Nick if you get killed. Lets just keep rolling.

I am worried about it. Because the incident affects other issues. Consider. Your character regularly talk back to people regardless of rank. No big deal, it's all banter. Now consider this (somewhat dramatized) recent exchange:

-Dirk: "You coward! If I ever see you do that again I'll kill you! Now sit there in the middle of the hangar doing nothing until I tell you!"
-Duncan: "Perhaps I should cover the dropship, as I have a sniper rifle?"
-Quinn: "Duncan, cover the dropship."
-Duncan: *Goes to cover the dropship.*
-Quinn: "Dirk, set up a perimeter."
-Dirk: "Duncan, although your sniper rifle is ill-suited for confined combat and your shotgun probably won't pierce body armor that hostile marines would likely have, I want you to secure the kitchen by yourself. I have spoken!"
-Duncan: "I was just ordered by Quinn to cover the dropship."
-Dirk: "Oh look, prima donna doesn't want to countermand Quinn's orders! There is no one else left to do it. I can't pull Morse, he was ordered to cover the dropship! And what if I need to order Farzi to do something, like covering the dropship?"
-Quinn: "I need Duncan providing cover. Pull people from other squads."
-Obi: *Is disgusted by Duncan's insubordinate act of following Quinn order.*

Shenanigans.

[Duncan]

Dirk -

I'll let other people speak for themselves, but based on the posts in this thread, I'm going to presume most people agree that this issue was largely a result of misreading posts and/or ambiguous layout of our positions. As for grenades, I addressed that in my last post.

Quinn -

As for talking with you, I was under the presumption that you were maybe ten feet away, relatively close to the action. I don't consider not opting to use a radio in that situation a display of criminal misbehavior.

[Quinn]

You disengaged despite orders to the contrary. That is a criminal behavior.

[Morse]

The solution I'm suggesting with Dirk is more to just keep the action moving without dealing with any serious punishment for either party. I'm saying Dirk did do it, but didn't hit you hard enough to cause a problem. If we work with that then we won't have the extreme issues that we do at the moment.

As for the double standard in regards to my character, I can see how that line is blury. But there are some details that always work within the scenario.

Morse, despite all of his verbal faults, is known to be incredibly reliable. He also has known the others for years. He was a private at the same time as Quinn, and Dirk was a Corporal when they first met. This is just the issue. Also note that Morse has been a Corporal for a very long time, while people have been newer have advanced rank higher then him at times. That is part of the draw back of having the mouth that he does.

But also a great deal of what Morse's 'insubordinate sounding' comments are made at moments of extreme duress. When Morse is shot, burned, or being shot at, he will typically scream obscinities and place blame. But its all just harmless rambling.

At the end though he's never had an incident where his loyalty, or resolve on a firing line has been called into question. --- Thats what makes this different.




So, there's no use going back and forth on all this. This really was just a missunderstanding in regards to possition (likely fuelled by my playing of Morse as a mean spirited asshole), but it all needs to go away and it will.

I think it adds flavor for internal stuff, something I like rather then always focussing on the mission. Whether its on a friend or foe basis, this sort of stuff is good and fun.

But Quinn and Dirk, just need to stop worryin about pressing charges. We just need to worry about who's behind us, and who's in front of us. All this amounts to is a shift of who's in who's squad next round.

[Dirk Pitt]

This is getting stupid.. Between my constant bitching and Duncan's shrill whining we have all posted on this thread MORE than in the game.. Wow.. That says we should all have longer and more direct posts.

That having been said Dirk DID hit Duncan, Who is tougher than Chuck Noris and couldn't be knocked down by a speeding APC

No really, Dirk should get, and Quinn said he would get an Art 15 Conduct unbecoming. I accept this freely. I even hope I get to RP the trial. Morse as a witness would be great!

On the other hand Duncan did disengage despite orders to the contrary. That by definition is Art 99. Then his going over Dirk's head in combat and going directly to Quinn to tell on the other Marines useing grenades. That is also against regs. Marines should and are expected to go by the chain of command. That would be office hours or NJP. Then you take all the smirking, talking back, not following orders by his squadleader and the rest that is too much to mention would be AT LEAST Art 15 conduct unbecoming.

With Dirk's record they would take pay and maybe confine him to base for a while. With Duncan's record of the brig, even without the Art 99, he would be heading back to the brig.

But like I said.. I put this in Quinn's hands. He's fair and I trust him.

[Quinn]

[sarcasm]Thanks[/sarcasm]

[Pale Rider]

Ok, now that we have all pissed in this particular bowl of Cheerios long enough let's get to work. However, I would like clarify one thing when I mentioned Tribunal it was not just for Duncan it was also for Dirk. James may have a history with Dirk, but we are first and foremost Marines and we should behave accordingly. When the mission is over you two can fight in the ring or get a hotel room but, if James dies because of people fussing during this mission his ghost is going to rip some heads off and crape down your necks. Do I make myself clear?

[Quinn]

Yes sergeant.

And I agree with Morse. All this will really do in game is switch around who is in what squad. Dirk is willing to have his character go through an Article 15, because he thinks it would be a unique RP opportunity. I'd have Morse go through one, but I have a feeling that the character has a stack of them a mile high already.

And don't think that Quinn is getting out of this unscathed either. Don't spoil it for them Dirk.

[Morse]

Hey, my posts are already pretty big, and pretty direct. I don't think anyone wants me making them bigger then they already are.

[Dirk Pitt]

Don't worry Quinn... I'm not talkin!!